As I suggested in the DQN ELECTRONICS VOL 2010 album thread, let's make our own VIP Quality music release!
Any contribution is welcome, so long as it is VIP Quality, and created for this project. Multiple contributions are obviously welcome too.
Once we have enough tracks, or once everyone has lost interest, and no later than in exactly four months (a deadline will keep us motivated), we will distribute by torrent and direct download.
To contribute music or artwork you can post your work in this thread, or to keep it secret until the day of release, you can send it to dqn.dqn.lol@gmail.com .
We can use this thread to discuss what to do, what title we want to use, plan collaborations, etc.
In case we need a wiki, let's put our stuff here: http://tanasinn.info/wiki/Homegrown_VIPtronic_Album
To prove that I'll be somewhat reliable, I am the guy who packaged Title, who harassed the participants to send in their tracks, and who did the worst songs on it: rest assured that unless nobody participates, something will eventually get released.
We definitely should try to use our own skills whenever possible. Volume leveling will be enough. We just need to...uh...do it this time, since it's more important to do it on something like this than on the Internet releases.
An additional point to note is that all samples have to be cleared. As of 2005, there is pretty much no such thing as fair use for samples. Nobody will press a record unless they get all the proper licensing and other legal stuff sorted.
Basically what this means is that sampling has to be kept to a minimum unless you want to pay licensing costs. :\
>>293
Or, at least, that's what some pressers say. Others just claim no legal liability. Either way, legal details will have to be settled beforehand if such a project gets off the ground.
>>283-294
First, note that I have not participated in the discussion you mentioned (I never use IRC).
I must quite bluntly say I am not very interested in making the VIPTRONIC project into a high-quality-standards, legally-clean, physically-released, money-involved kinda racket.
Of course, if other people want to make it happen, I have no reason to attempt to prevent it.
But let's review a few facts:
A. We had less than 100 downloads in two weeks.
This time, the torrent having accidentally been the only way to acquire the release, the stats are pretty accurate.
It's safe to assume the http mirrors had very few downloads, too.
Disregard entirely the fapis stats of the 1st homegrown viptronic album. It's almost only bots. I think it reported 300 "downloads" just in the last month.
I don't think we will find 100 vinly fetishists willing to drop money for this stuff.
B. If we remove illegal sampling and illegal covers (that are pretty much impossible to prosecute in free pseudonymous net releases) we'd axe tons of tracks from the previous releases.
For the last one, instances I either noticed or committed:
C. The point of this release in my opinion is just to have fun and get some people who don't usually record music to attempt to do so.
Forgot that wakabamark automatically "fixes" the numbers in lists. Disregard the numbers and use only the titles to know which song I refer to
>>295
Well, the general idea was to make something a little different from the regular VIPtronic albums. I recall suggesting at one point that this was to be a special release and not part of the main VIPtronic series, which are made "just to have fun" like you stated in C. What we were thinking of was a special one-time thing where we make something that will be enjoyed by VIPPERs for many generations.
The general idea was not to make a commercial release. Nobody intends to make a profit here. We just want to break even or get something a little close to that. We want to try to do something that will cause an exceptional piece of VIP QUALITY unlike any other before it, but it costs VIP COINS.
Now, I'd also like to point out that we were strongly considering the fact we wouldn't get 100 VIPPERs from SAoVQ to buy a VIPtronic vinyl. That's why we were going to reach out to communities with similar interests, like the ones suggested earlier (and especially DQN). If we do so, we'd have more of a shot at realistically doing this.
As for sampling, well, obviously we'd be making original tracks for this special album. The best VIP QUALITY is the kind made entirely from original material, no matter how much we love to copy and paste AA. I'd expect people to make an effort to record their own VIP vocals and collaborate in any way possible, because that's how VIPPERs operate.
We would have trashed the idea in IRC if we thought it wasn't entirely possible. I personally would love to see you in on this project as well, so don't think, feel, and you will be tanasinn.
Given that, like most people, listening to vinly requires hoping that my family's 60's hardware still works, I'm not very excited about it.
I also don't like the idea of drawing unnecessary attention to SAoVQ. But if this is going to happen, and if there's a a digital version of the release, then I'd definitely submit a quality (or at least, not half-assed) track.
I'll wait and see what you guys prefer to do for now.
We don't have to explicitly advertise that this is a product of SAoVQ...it's a product of VIP QUALITY. SAoVQ just happens to be a secret area of VIP QUALITY, and we don't have any obligation to direct people here. It'd have as much connection at the end as DQN ELECTRONICS releases (since they're on tanasinn.info), and those haven't ruined us or anything.
I see your misgivings, but hey, it'd be pretty VIP regardless. If nothing else, we'd have a lot of fun making something like this and feel an accomplishment as a VIP community that we were able to pull something as crazy as this off.
Once we make some contacts and try to think the specifics through more, it'll become more apparent if it's possible or not. I'm remaining optimistic.
>>295
>>298
As DJ Zovi has said, this would most likely require a collaborative effort with another community of VIP-minded individuals.
Secondly, with regards to sampling, not all pressers are so anal. Some of them just give a warning up front that the legal liability lies upon whomever is soliciting the order. If it came right down to it, I would be willing to accept some of the liability.
Since this release is likely to be fairly limited in number and pretty much limited only to those who would be willing to donate in advance, it wouldn't really be advertising SAoVQ. By the way, nobody would be making a profit off of this because there is really no profit to be made in vinyl; it's strictly a break-even operation.
I know something like this requires a great deal of effort, time, and such, but I think it would be awesome if we could have something on physical media to fill our ears with VIP QUALITY.
Just curious, how many VIPPERs have decent turntables? I'm a bit of an audiophile with about $10k in my speaker system, even have a tubed headphone amp, but vinyl seems like too much maintenance.
>>301
For most post-80s vinyl pressings, there's not a whole lot of maintenance required. Try not to scratch them up too badly, keep them out of extreme temperatures and store them upright.
I don't even own a turntable, but I'd still love to see this happen, if only for maintaining the legacy of VIP. I do DJ at a radio station that has a couple turntables, and I can assure you that I would give a VIP QUALITY album many plays (do'nT woRRY I wilL pAy dadDY CoOl EnouGH licenSINg feeEs. ;)) I would certainly contribute a track if this project gets off the ground.
I also agree that we shouldn't worry too much about sampling--a private pressing like this just wouldn't get enough attention for anybody to care, as long as the presser doesn't care.
I can't guarantee I'd end up contributing something, but if I did it'd be something I spent more than an hour and a half indiscriminately whipping together. I think it'd be way cool to have a VIP QUALITY vinyl, even if I hardly ever pull out my turntable.
Since you seem all interested, two questions:
Personally I'm against a digtial release. I feel this should be SAoVQ's counter to DQN Electronics 10.
>>305
>>306
The way I see it, if there's a digital release, and there really should be, then it would likely be slightly different from the physical release.
As for the project lead, I figured it could be more of a collaborative thing. Zovi has a lot of details involving contacting interesting persons and other such matters. I'm more of an idea guy.
But, I don't necessarily speak for the project as a whole.
I'll help lead the project if nobody has objections. I agree with >>306 but it'd be good to have a high-quality file backup ready for anybody who has the vinyl just in case they don't have the means to rip the vinyl to their computer to listen in a portable manner or whatever. It just wouldn't be public and it would be in the same level of secrecy as DQN ELECTRONICS VOL 10. Maybe a sampler would be cool, though, like a mixed 30-seconds-per-song file to give an idea of what's on it.
I just don't see the point. If we do something worth having, someone with a newfangled USB turntable will probably rip it and upload it, with the loss of quality analog->digital necessarily implies. Wouldn't it be better to preempt it with a quality full-digital release?
The digital version could be delayed from the physical product if we find it necessary to provide some incentive to buy the record.
If it's supposed to be some sort of collector item, the value isn't in the music itself anyway.
And if it's supposed to be a top secret release, that's kinda too late now that we've talked about it in public.
>The digital version could be delayed
This is actually pretty much along the lines of what I was thinking. But again, the digital release would probably be somewhat different from the physical release in order to (I guess) justify it.
>>311
Well, I was talking more in terms of something like locked grooves. Yes, you can rip the audio and then edit it to loop correctly, but it's not quite the same as playing it from the record.
Anyway, it's pretty much like you said, the value is mostly in the fact that it's on physical media. We want something tangible that VIPPERs can enjoy.
Or we could make the vinyl a special thing with some bonus tracks after a digital free release...there are a lot of possibilities. I like the idea of making the physical media version have something special like locked grooves, but I agree with BENOIST's saying that it doesn't matter that you can probably get it for free online. It's much better to have the physical version. That's why people still buy CDs even though they're ripped online...well, I do, anyway...
>>309 As far as I'm aware, no one's ripped and upped DQN Electronics 10, or else I'm not looking hard enough...
>>314
Even if nobody cares enough to rip something, what would be the point on working on such a project just to say to people "no, you can't have it"?
I don't think we were intending to make the tracks themselves secretive, as that would be a little...Elitist...
And elitists too! We have taken this conversation to private channels. E-mail GBB or another elitist to join in, but expect harsher quality standards than the all-inclusive normal VIPTRONIC releases.
These guys are serious, all of them have "MySpace Music" pages, and a couple even release quality shit for free every once in a while. Some of them have been featured in "J-Core" collections and I'm sure have made money off of their tuff beats.
I think the only artist on the VIPTRONIC album should be VIPPER--but I really do feel kind of disappointed sometimes when I download one of these albums to come out of DQN or SAOVQ and there's shit like 43 minutes of just samples of a dude saying "it's all about jesus" layered over each other repeatedly. I mean can anyone really even stand the crap mixtapes /jp/ comes up with?
Course they have lots of individuals there
The VIPtronic project for 2011-01-01 isn't canceled, so long as people still wish to participate.
Whether people use artist names or not is their own choice. I think people can understand the anonymous board culture without enforcing the cult of anonymity. It's not like you see names popping up unnecessarily in other threads, do you? There's also a lot of polite saging in this thread.
The project BENOIST and DJ Zovi are organizing won't be a VIPtronic release. Think of it as music done by people who originally met through the VIPtronic project. There will be a bunch of new faces participating, too. And we certainly don't care to make money on this project.
>>319
jesus phase was done in the style of a famous experimental musician named Steve Reich, and was arguably the same quality. Ship Going Down seems to be mostly interested in organic music and musique concrete. I wouldn't slam that song in particular for being worthless and having no artistic merit. Like Reich's tracks, jesus phase uses phasing to create new sounds out of the same sound looped and layered. The track also has a bell-curve shape and very interesting dynamics between sounds once it starts to drone. I guess art music like that isn't appreciated as much as it should be, though.
>I guess art music like that isn't appreciated as much as it should be, though.
When you hide crap behind the word 'art', it doesn't change that it's crap, nor protect it from valid criticism.
>valid criticism
If you think criticism that consists of complaining about the length and the entire composition of the piece is valid, I question your definition of criticism. If one is going to criticize something in a way where you won't get called out for it, one would give better reasons than that. For example, a criticism that would be valid about this piece that fits with your opinionated statements is that the piece could have had the same effect if it were only 10 minutes long, and that Ship Going Down may have gotten overzealous with taking Reich's model to the extremes, since the middle droning part actually doesn't lend much to the original purpose of phase music like this. I probably would've agreed with you on those points.
Regardless, let's not get into a full-out debate about avant-garde music and get back to the VIP QUALITY, hm? The discussion about the non-VIPtronic album has long since ended in this thread and discussion should resume about the third VIPtronic album.
>>325
I don't think anyone truly believes that a child who draws a horrible sketch has made something with significant artistic merit.
While I agree with your point, let's just drop this. Seriously. Or at least take it somewhere else.
Guys, I think Jesus phase was a joke.
So, two albums? Assuming the QUALITY is not diluted, that's twice as good as one.
Could the VIPPER who goes by the artist name Michigan D. Ghost please email me at zovi@djzovi.com? I have a question to ask that is related to the stuff that's not being discussed in this thread anymore. That is all.
If there's now going to be a non-Vippertronics album project too, where should we go to discuss this?
>>331
Discussion is taking place between the contributing parties. When more tangible information becomes available, a new thread should pop up.
I have a really early submission for the next album. (That's a change of pace!) I just made a track and I thought it was pretty nice, so here you go:
http://img.secretareaofvipquality.net/src/(P)yramid.zip
>>334
Really nice one!
Safely archived. (Twice. Not gonna risk losing old files again when the time comes to release!)
Here's a summary of the current situation:
I am committed to help both projects being awesome.
I've been following the progress of these albums, and would like to contribute myself. I shall have to contact zovi.
You should! By the way, we consider a September release for the other album.
Sorry to announce, but my host has been parked and so my mirrors are no longer running. HOPEFULLY we will get a new URL soon however, if Tom notices.
Bump since I'm making all kinds of COOL FREE RINGTONES today.
>>340
http://www.aoamedia.com/audioextractor.htm , http://listentoyoutube.com , google "record stereo mix".
BTW, we are using this thread for VIPTRONIC stuff now: http://www.secretareaofvipquality.net/saovq/kareha.pl/1283647297